wave tosses ball / star punch

[mok]

First-off from my perspective I see no difference in the sets between those 2 sequences. That said, I've seen the same core technique performed in many different ways and I was wondering what were your thoughts on it:

1. Some turn the fist in at the end and turn it into a long-range upercut

2. Some keep the arm straight and level with the head above

3. Some lean under the arm and extend further

Here is LSW demonstrating it: notice the straight arm



Now here is a video of Tony Kam, a well-known lama pai sifu:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6Kx4iXZbW8[/youtube]


There are many rising pao chui's in this vid. But notice in almost all of them the lama practitionner leans under his strike, tucking his head in. This is made possible in large part due to their sweeping footwork structure, but I feel this provides for more extension, more power, and is a better position defensively as it covers the head from the front (at the cost of exposing more ribs). Also, by leaning under the head is no longer "in the way" and this allows for a longer arc, and allows you to use more of your shoulders and back for power.

I understand the interpretation shown by LSW is less "committed" (perhaps this is another example of lau principle in our flavor), but I have tried it both ways and I am really liking the lama version. Now if supposedly this sequence is from lama pai, then perhaps it might be worth keeping in mind some other ways of performing it? especially since arguably the lama-version is "the source".

[PM]

dear mok,

interesting topic.

coming from the Lam Family Hung kyun background, we do it as grandmaster Lam Saiwing on the picture (eyes/nose level). your head is still more than well covered when you perform it in this way.

the usage of "water wawe throwing strike" (seui long paau cheui) depends on the footwork and body movements. we train it in many different ways:

- as shadow boxing drill - on the spot/moving, frontally/laterally
- in combinations with oer techniques (which cover the weaknes of the the strike)
- with the weights (paau cheui has to be fast as hell, because even it is applied more economically in the fight, it still travels lobger path than straight jab [fo jin cheui]), so training with the weights is crucial
- rolling, throwing and catching the log
- in pairs - offensive drills, defensive drills, strike/strike, block/block, block/strike, strike/block, against different types of attack and aimed to the different parts of the body. anyway, blocks are not blocks, but also attacks

again, the set-up, footwork, body movement and follow up is crucial, in other words - i can hit you, but you cannot hit me

btw. i think grandmaster Ho Laptin does it more in the lama paai way, so do other branches.

anyway, Lam Saiwing was particulary famous for his paau cheui (Loksin theatre battle)

i still did not find any textual proof that our long hands come from lama paai, although it is pretty obvious. if anybody has a reliable source of who and when has aded those techniques to Hung Kyun, please tell us more

btw., see http://www.lama-martialart.com/ nice lama paai website i just found last week

[Asmo]

[mok]

[Asmo]

[mok]

[NaamKyun.com]

[Asmo]

[PM]

the context of yat sing paau cheui, yi sing paau cheui is "seven stars continuous strikes" ( chat sing lin waan cheui), that is the reason why is it called differently than seui long paau kau.

daai ma gwai chou is used differently than sau baan daan gwai

sometimes we have different names for same technique, and the usage is same, sometimes the usage is different

anyway, i would not be fixed to much to the names, sometimes they are even mixed up in those 3 books, so are the pics

[TenTigers]

[Chris H]

[PM]