Self learning

[PM]

shuen, Franky: i think the difference is more in old/new, traditional/modern and nothern/southern terminology. if you check the old Southern gf manuals, you very seldom meet ma bou, gung bou, heui bou (= ma bu, gong bu, xu bu), but you see plenty of sei ping ma, ji ng ma, diu (geuk) ma. in the North, they use bou/bu, "step" for the stance, in the south ma, "horse". ma bou has a little different meaning in the South, it means generally "stances and footwork", not a specific stance. anyway, it gets all mixed up today, so it really does not matter, although i personally prefer the old, Southern way.

jau ma, nau/lau ma and tau ma is a different case, here it is really descrition how to get to the stance (called usually neui ji ma)

although we are stealing this topic, it is interesting, more food for though for my encyclopedy. althoug it is called A Conceise Encyclopedy of Hung Kyun, i want to be as complete and accurate as possible.

to the topic: vaulander, i admire your enthusiasm and hard work, but still, i strongly suggest to forget about DVDs, save the money and learn from a teacher. in the USA, you have so many choices, man! i wish you all the best in your training!

[ironpalm]

[PM]

[vaulander]

The website I found with terminology (not extensive, but a good starting point is as follows:

http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/info/glossary.php

I was a little reluctant to name the DVD's I have learned from, as I didn't want to cause any gruff with people who may follow different lineages and similar, but here is the link, from Kwong Wing Lam's wle.com site:

http://www.wle.com/store/wlv_hunggar_dvd.html

I must admit that although I and my training partners started from the beginning, with Arrow Hand and Lau Gar Kuen, we may have rushed those to get to the Kung Gee Fook Fu Kuen, as everything I've read of Hung Gar names that set as the foundation. I finished learning the set (or movements of the set, I am starting from scratch to learn the set proper,) in late January this year, and full of pride and satisfaction I filmed a clip, called V Kung Gee 1 on youtube, trying to be flash for the camera. After that, I ate a big slice of Humble Pie, as I know far better than the horrifying joke I look like.

I do have a bit of a problem though. My joints have never been what you can call flexible, my wrists cannot go in a 90 degree angle unless I push the palms of my hands together and force my elbows up, which isn't pleasant at all. The ankles, or footjoints are my biggest problem in stances, and after 4-5 years of bicycling everywhere instead of driving, they are very tight. My cat stances are very high, and I have to turn my feet out for even a moderate horsestance, otherwise my butt goes out and I have to lean forward in order not to fall on my ass. I stretch after every ride, but still it is not enough. Instead of saving for a visit with a teacher, I should save for a visit with an ex russian weightlifter turned masseuse and have him/her brutalize my legs until they are soft as Jello and then stretch until they scream.

[shuen]

[Sifu at Large]

[vaulander]

Yes, it is challenging. That is, in some ways, the charm of it. The fight, the struggle, the 'I'm gonna get this down and get good at it,' that drives me on.

I first started riding a bicycle (after 15 years since last time,) in september of 2004. My car broke down and I had no money to fix it or get another one, so I got a cheapo Roadmaster bike at Wal-Mart, where I work. By december I had a better bike, and January 6th, we had a snowstorm that shut down the town (except for Wal-Mart, that doesn't close except for christmas day.) I fought my way to work, when over a hundred driving associates called in, and some of them live closer than I do. Before that day, everyone had shaken their head at me, wondering what I would do when winter comes, why I don't get a car, yada yada. I had to prove I could do it, to myself. Four and a half miles one way of deep rutted snow, and heavy headwind. Same thing on the way back.

It is the same thing here. When I practice the horse stance, I put on a song, and stay standing, shaking and sweating and begging the song to go faster, until it is over and I sort of collapse forward as I can't straighten my legs. Same thing with the horsewalk (3 kiu sau, step, 3 kiu sau, step..) I have a distance between two speedbumps by my garage, and I will make it between them sooner or later, if I have to crawl home afterwards. When I can finally do the whole stretch, I will turn around and do it again.

[mok]

We use a variation on the cantonese:

sei ping ma, kim yeurng ma, yao (right) ji ma, jwo (left) ji ma, yao (right) diu ma, jwo (left) diu ma, + loi ji ma / nau ma / tau ma.

For some reason sifu does not use Ding Ji Ma or Ji Ng Ma, but we just refer to these as right-side or left-side (yao ji ma / jwo ji ma, etc).

One thing we used to do back in the day when were young and had too much free time was sei ping ma while watching a tv show... 30 mins and up to an hour without break is easy with an easy slacker stance (say 40 degrees or so) when your mind is on something else. Or start with 15-20 mins with a hard "parallel" stance then you can slack off. It's even easier with a buddy or two as it keeps you motivated and "honest".

However I wouldn't do too much static training... It's great when you're just starting. But at this point, even if I would have trouble doing the above (except in the slacker scenario) I would be wasting time doing static stances. I'd be better off doing forms or bag work, or drills.

[vaulander]

Put up some short training vids on youtube for you to laugh at.

account: vikverjar

V Kung Gee 4

Footwork (keep staring at my bloody feet, so I am not doing it properly. Also shows the limits of my ankles in the cat stance.)
kungsection

partialkung (batteries ran out)
striking


Of course my fellow students and training partners decided to be funny, messing with my focus, but it's all good.

[TenTigers]

1-SIT in your stances. Think and FEEL from your dan-tien-you are way too upper body chest heavy. You lock your back leg on yuor cat, making you break at the waist, chest foward and chin up-this completely misaligns your spine. Tuck (slightly) your sacrum ,and your chin.
STOP in each stance. Pause, and collect yourself. Allow yourself to feel and make the proper adjustments in your structure. THEN do the next move. Otherwise, you are simply walking through yuor form, repeating the same mistakes over and over again, without making any progress. What is worse, you are ingraining your maistakes.
Remember-Practice doesn't make perfect.
Practice makes Permanant.

2-focus your strikes. Ping Choy goes to the xiphoid-elbow behind the fist.
Butterfly Palms go to the xiphoid and heart-yours are focused at the hip and over your opponent's shoulder (all over the place)
TAKE YOUR TIME. Do not be in a hurry. Slow it down and focus on your structure. Feel each individual movement.

I hope you are not taking my words as harsh. I am simply being firm.
You cannot hear tone of voice in type.

[vaulander]

Oh, don't worry about being harsh. If you drove up, got out of the car, and started smacking the back of my head for every mistake, I would be grateful. You'd have tennis elbow after from overuse, but that would be your problem, hehe.

The Cat stance is my big problem, with my lack of leeway in the ankle. If I do it to where it feels okay, I feel like I am just standing there 'chillin' with a toe on the ground. It's when I do it the way I think it should be that I get all locked up. I am working on a stance drill to get more comfy and natural with the stances, and I know it takes time.

So the butterfly palms should be closer together, hitting the bottom (xiphoid,) and middle of the sternum? I thought it was for the face and solar/xiphoid. Given enough force that would be like a reverse CPR effect.

I appreciate every bit of advice and help you good people are offering, and I do my best to learn. I'd rather learn from getting my ego pounded than having my face pounded for doing things wrong when it matters.
Thank you all,
V.

[TenTigers]

where do you live? I will be driving from NY to DC this weekend, if you are naywhere in the vicinity, I can bring an elbow brace...

[TenTigers]

as far as your ankle flexibility is concerned, it is not the issue I am referring to. When I said, "sit" in your stance, I didn't mean lower. What I meant was settle into your stance. I think when I keep mentioning the dan-tien, I might be making it sound all deep n'mystical n'stuff, but to me, there is no other way to express it. When you focus on that area, as if it were the pivotal point of all your power, you will feel your body settle.

[vaulander]

I am in Council Bluffs, Iowa, just on the border to Nebraska, Omaha.

I am curious to what you would bring an elbow brace for?
V.

[TenTigers]

"I am curious to what you would bring an elbow brace for?"


"If you drove up, got out of the car, and started smacking the back of my head for every mistake, I would be grateful. You'd have tennis elbow after from overuse, but that would be your problem, hehe. "