Lower stances

[Mig]

When I started Hung Ka, back in the old golden days, I remember that our stances were low but I've noticed, and now even more, that some people really do very low stances when doing a form. Now I started to look up more carefully when someone is competing either in kumite, sanshou or even street fighting, most of the time those who have practiced for sometime, their stances are not as low. I understand that balance is crucial in fighthing but wanted to hear your experiences and opinions when you've practiced southern boxing in which lower stances are important.

Thanks,

Mig

[jow yeroc]

In our jow gwoon, sifu stresses low stance in training and forms but we fight different than form. Stance is higher and more mobile.

[TenTigers]

I have my beginner students do low, deep horse for the first basic training sets, and then later the horse is higher. Same with the ji ng ma-bow stance. In the beginning sets, the stance is low, back leg locked. Later, the stance is narrower, rear leg not locked, sacrum tucked, chest swallowed.
It is a teaching method for developing foundational strength, and for teaching the basics. Later, the training gets more technical, more individualised, more one on one.
__________________
my opinion, (and this is also based on other Sifus that I have spoken to on this very subject) is that in the past several generations, as the need for combat lessened,people did not train to fight, but to perform. Stances became lower, more dynamic. More emphasis was placed on forms, two-man sets, weapon sets, etc.
If you look at the photos of LSW,his stances were not deep and low. His back leg was not locked, his sacrum was tucked, and chest swallowed.
And in those pics, he was not elderly, but in his prime.

[Asmo]

I'm seeing double TT! Or maybe it was deja-vu, I'm sure I read this before....

Hihihi!

Forms are methods to teach fighting, real fighting is different, not like forms. Real fighting does not look like the old Shaw movies. Your horse is as deep as is necessary, but usually much higher.

[Dee]

[jow yeroc]

Here is my comfort range..

Training and form horse:


fighting horse(again MY comfort level. Others may be different)


any remarks, critique is cool.
I know i look like i'm about to mug somebody but it's cold and i just got off work..
cheers

[TenTigers]

Asmo-yeah, I have a tendancy to repeat myself.
also, I have a tendancy to repeat myself!
Then again, look how long I was harping on people fighting with their Gung-Fu and not like kickboxers, and years later, we are just starting to see others throwing gwa, sow, charp, been, cup, etc. in some Chinese Tournaments. BTW-I was at a tournament last year and one of the judges, was getting on my student about throwing "wild swings" (sow choys and cup choys) I told him we were a Hung-Ga school and those are our bread and butter strikes. Then I asked him what style he taught. He said, "Jow-Ga." I almost yelled at him,"YOU of all people should be familiar with these strikes! They're YOUR bread and butter too!" He apologized, and the fight continued.
...then they disqualified my guy. oh well.

Jow yeroc-That's pretty much on target as far as I'm concerned.
Also-check out "Mexican Style" boxers. They fight from almost a horse often as well.

[Asmo]

When judges have no clue anymore, what's the state of the arts? And how do you keep your students motivated to enter such events?

[TenTigers]

I tell them this:
you don't have any control over whether the judges are not good, or biased.
You don't have any control over whether your opponents are better than you. Sometimes they are simply more skilled, or more talented, or it was just his day.
The only thing you do have control over is your own preparation.If you lose due to the things you have no control over, that's ok. That's just the way it goes sometimes.
BUT-if you lose due to lack of preparation on your part, you have no one to blame but yourself.

The idea is to go in there and enjoy yourself. Do your best, represent your school, your Sifu, your style, your history with honor.
Show them who we are, and be proud.
Make friends. Cheer each other on.
Watch other schools and learn.
But most of all, enjoy yourself.

[Asmo]

Yes that is all very true of course, and I fully agree. But the contest is the base of the whole event

I always travel along with contests, also for youth etc, just for the reasons you mentioned above. Its all good fun

[jow yeroc]

Well, i can't speak for the judge on that particular day TT. Don't know if he was from my school or not. But as you said, at least in our school, these wheel punches and our stepping is our bread and butter. Our fighters are DQ'ed often not because of lack of martial ethic or unsportsmanship but because we're taught to fight a certain way that is not really conducive to light contact. So if one enters into that sort of competition one has to be able to balance cup, sow, lok, gwa with control.
We always end up looking like the evil cobra kai school when somebodies nose gets busted. But sifu is a little sadistic and would prolly pull one to the side and just laugh that funny evil laugh and say "You see? If that was a real fight he would be knock out!! Hee-heee!!"