Blocking?

[laukarfei]

[Rising Crane]

[crazedjustice888]

[PM]

[Rising Crane]

[crazedjustice888]

That makes a lot of sense and MAN your sifus Grandfather must have had a MONSTROUS stance...I myself have long arms and long legs which David Chin says is perfect for the Hop Gar system, but I am light. I can't seem to put on weight no matter WHAT I do...lol so my Hung gar sifu also teaches Shui Jiao...hope I spelled that right, to allow me to counter those kinds of techniques. So I get what you mean and am glad what I said made sense.

Also, I will gladly send your regards to my sifu.

[laukarfei]

hey CJ what have you tried as far as putting on weight, maybe i(we) can give you some pointers

[crazedjustice888]

Well...basically eating and rings and now Mok Yee Pai...lol

[TOET]

Cj if you haven't hit 30 you will add more weight than you want around there

[crazedjustice888]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! I JUST turned 20 January 10th...lol People just think I am too skinny, but today I actually held my own against Shuai Chiao guys...it was AWESOME!!!!

[inthebakyard]

[Daifong]

To me, "blocking" is when my movement has been hampered somehow, or I just got plain surprised...

Also, in a surprise situation, it is safer and more natural to block or "cover up" than it is to counter-strike...

While I did know a fellow who used to take pride in the fact that he'd respond automatically with an elbow strike any time that someone tapped his shoulder, if that person had a knife or gun (or just happened to be his girl or mom ), it could be problematic!

[ironpalm]

[indrafist]

Hi all,

Re 'Blocking' in Tibetan Lion's Roar Lama-Pai.

I remember when I started Lion’s Roar (Chan Tat Fu lineage – from Au-Wing-Ning Lama/White Crane Kong Tow: Hop-Gar from Wong Hon-Wing, and Wong-Hop-Liu: from Wong Yan Lum) hearing from my Chinese Si-Hing that “Lion’s Roar doesn’t block!”

I mention the lineage, just to say that lineages do differ, so I’m only speaking for my own.

After some time, I found out something about the subtleties of the notion of ‘not blocking’. Firstly, there’s a semantic issue, which many forum colleagues here have outlined already: ‘blocking’ and active engagement with a bridge may, or may not, mean the same thing. I agree broadly with everything said so far – including the distinctions made, and the real-world caveats flagged-up. Secondly though, through experience both in other styles, and then in progression through my Lion’s Roar, I found that the ‘not blocking’ notion took on a relative status: i.e. both ‘yes and no’, and especially so, when engaging the bridge.

One of the ruling principles in Tibetan Lion’s Roar is ‘Sim’ 閃

Sim can manifest in the Lion's Roar! derivative martial arts systems (Hop-Gar, Lama-Pai, Sai-Jong Pak-Hok-Pai) in a number of ways, the most commonly found is an emphasis on striking from position, and using 'space' creatively to dispense with the need for blocking or making contact thru the 'bridge'.

Here, Sim is used to describe a mastery of timing and position, within which to draw the opponent into opening themselves, overextending or simply to 'miss' either in timing, or, physically. The Western boxing principle of 'drawing' is similar.

In some Tibetan lineages, the notion of non-contact and use of space to avoid having to block is given great emphasis. It is seen as being one of the highest of all skills - to use evasion and space, so effectively, that blocking or any kind of passive contact with the opponent is unnecessary.
In practice however, it is (at least) sometimes a better 'notion' than it is a workable 'application'. Problems can occur when this interpretation of Sim becomes elevated to a kind of supraordinate dogmatic status.

The Chinese character for Sim 閃 is made up in part from the Chinese character for 'Mun' 門(Gate), and ‘Ren’ 人(Person) - a person INSIDE the Gate.

This is an echo of the original Sanskrit (Hindu) meaning of ‘Avarana’ as being the definitive engagement within the Bardo (Antarala) times, and spaces. Notice also how the character for Sim appears within the Chinese word for lightening 閃電光. Sim (evasion) is part of the Diamond Thunderbolt of Martial Tantra (lightning)

Sim acts against the opponent like a flash of lightening in a doorway. The Bardo field is any interval or in-between state, and describes spatial and temporal relationships in-between structures, but also in-between thoughts, and the cross-modal zone of thought and action.

The Tantric deity for Sim is Maya (illusion) as an aspect of Goddess Kali the destroyer. Illusion, deception, drawing, are all aspects of entrapment within the Bardo-State, so it is appropriate that Maya is the aspect of Bodhicitta that stands for this principle. However, the Bardo Field itself, is the domain of Vishnu - the Master of all cross-over or in-between points - including gates or doorways. Maya spins her web of illusion to entrap the opponent within Vishnu's realm - hence the Chinese character for Sim 閃 includes that for the doorway or gate, Mun: 門 and person Ren: 人

In Chinese transliterations of "Bardo", the Character 間 (Jiaan in Mandarin and Gaan in Cantonese) is often applied meaning: "leak; space in between; interval; between two things; the space between; within a definite time or space". Note the similarity between the Character 閃 (Sim) an that of 間 (Gaan). Both involve the concept of the Gate or Door. Note too the emphasis on to 'Leak' in Gaan, to slip in-between the spatial and temporal points, and by inference, to do this within moments of arc-path, structure and thought, within contact or near contact with the opponent. This is a subtle difference in usual translation of 'Bardo' which in non-martial Buddhist terms, most often describes the period between death and rebirth, that the Tibetans refer to as the Bardo-Thodol/Antarala: as any in-between state, time or condition, and the specific notion of Antarala-Bhava meaning: "Between Births". The Tibetans keep to the Indian conception by discriminating Bardo from Bardo-Thodol, but some practitioners separate them in representational terms, even further.

Many branches of the Lion's Roar martial art tend to concentrate on the voids in space (between them and the opponent) and thereby induce - thru movement, a temporal (timing) void in the opponents structure. The goal being to disrupt the opponents ability to fix and fire, whilst themselves being vulnerable to incoming strikes from within a 'void' state - this is creation of action out from a void (a Bardo). The Chinese have so refined this aspect of Avarana that they have discarded action against the structure of the opponent in time and space - thru contact. Hence, for some Chinese lienages, 'evasion' has become 'avoidance' of contact - including 'blocking'.

In Lion’s Roar, the Crane totem animal division, disdains continuous contact with the opponent thru the 'bridge'. It does not however neglect contact per se, rather it functions as an avian would: it flutters and vibrates rotational forces to propel the opponent into a state of disruption, but it does NOT stick (as say Wing Chun). Metaphorically, a bird would avoid sticking to the opponent, its feathers are too fragile, so it uses rapid, spiralling rotational forces. Try to catch hold of a bird in your hands and you will see what I mean....

The progression of 'Sim' in Tibetan Lion’s Roar, is then to find ever more refined Bardo-Voids. The angles exploited are far smaller, the temporal intervals are far shorter and the Sim principle is extended to cover both thoughts and combat strategies, in the opponent.

Information processing overload, creates a natural Bardo state. The actions of working the bridge and the close dimensions of contact and near-contact provide a broad spectrum bandwidth of overload for the opponent. Into the gaps in structure and thought thus created, the Lion’s Roar penetrates (Chune) and arrests (intercepts: Jeet), moving the fight to its completion point: destruction (Chon).

Sim also utilizes the opponents 'method' or strategy - his 'style' of action of fighting, his intention etc, by non-compliance with them. The Lion’s Roar fighter induces the Bardo state and penetrates (Chune) the door.

Sim 'evades' the opponents concepts too, so contact or non-contact are un-necessary considerations. It is only necessary to utilize the Bardo thru deception and illusion, NOT to avoid contact (including ‘blocking’) to do that is perhaps to misunderstand the root principles of the art.

In the Hindu religion, Narasimha – the ‘Man Lion’ and 4th avatar of Vishnu (master of the Antarala/Bardo) acts to protect humankind from an unbeatable demon, who cannot be killed in daylight, or night-time, nor either inside or outside a building. Narasimha destroys him ‘inside the door’ (a crossing point) at twilight (a crossover time). This is where ‘Sim’ should be used – in the Bardo times and spaces. This can be either on contact, or otherwise, and so can involve blocking and active engagement, or a total avoidance of ‘blocking’.

Respect,

Indra

[ironpalm]

...So timing (and space) is everything!